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Designing Products That Build Trust and Delight Kids

• Taylor Shanklin

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Jordan Diatlo is the CEO and founder of Leadoff Studio, an acclaimed industrial design studio based in Long Island City, New York. With a rich professional history in industrial and product design, Jordan has worked with major companies including Nike, Walmart, and Lululemon, as well as numerous innovative startups. Originally passionate about graphic design, Jordan transitioned to industrial design during his education at Carnegie Mellon University. He has significant experience in the industry, having designed over 60 products during his tenure at Quirky, a startup known for pushing the boundaries of invention.

Episode Summary:

In this episode of Talking Shizzle, host Taylor Wilson converses with Jordan Diatlo, the visionary behind Leadoff Studio. Discover the intricate world of industrial design, where creativity and functionality merge to create innovative, tangible products. Jordan sheds light on the exciting journey from ideation to market, detailing how Leadoff Studio collaborates with entrepreneurs to turn their visions into reality. The episode also dives into the fascinating stories behind some of the products Jordan has helped design for brands like Ro, Nike, and Lululemon, highlighting his expertise in crafting user-friendly consumer experiences.

Join as Jordan takes us through the meticulous process of product development, emphasizing the importance of user experience and brand trust in industrial design. With a focus on creating products that stand out, he shares insights into the challenges and triumphs of designing for top brands and startups alike. Whether it's a transformative dental product for children or innovative packaging for online pharmacies like Ro, Jordan’s work exemplifies the art and science of industrial design. Aspiring entrepreneurs and design enthusiasts will find this episode rich with wisdom and inspiration.

Key Takeaways:

  • Product Development Process: Jordan elaborates on the step-by-step process from idea inception to manufacturing, highlighting the importance of understanding the user's journey.
  • Building Brand Trust: Hear about the critical role of packaging and user experience in establishing trust, particularly in sensitive sectors like healthcare.
  • Navigating Challenges: Learn from Jordan's experiences as he shares the trials of working with major brands and startups, emphasizing adaptability and creativity.
  • Evolving Industry Insights: Discover the dynamic nature of industrial design and how Jordan’s journey from graphic design to industrial design informs his current work.
  • Entrepreneurial Wisdom: Jordan offers valuable advice for aspiring entrepreneurs looking to dive into product design and development.

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0:00:00 Taylor Wilson: This is the Talking Shizzle show where we meet entrepreneurs who are shaking things up. Let’s go. Hey, y’. All. I am so excited about this episode where I got to sit down with Jordan Diatlo. He is the CEO and founder of Leadoff Studio. They are an industrial design studio based in New York City. They’re just kind of in Brooklyn and Queens area, which we talked about a little bit. And I got to sit down with Jordan and talk about how we got into industrial product design.

0:00:32 Taylor Wilson: Design and some of the really fun stories of products he has helped bring to market. So we’re talking about physical goods, products, just something like this cup or this water bottle. What goes into sparking an idea and then actually taking it all the way through to where you have your product on shelves in stores or available to buy online. So enjoy this episode with Jordan. I learned a lot of new stuff about product industrial design and just had a really great time talking to him.

0:01:06 Taylor Wilson: Jordan, how are you today?

0:01:08 Jordan Diatlo: I’m doing great. How are you, Taylor?

0:01:11 Taylor Wilson: I’m good. I’m good. How’s New York? You’re in New York City. Where exactly in New York City are you? Remind me.

0:01:16 Jordan Diatlo: Yeah, so our office is located in Long Island City, which is in Queens. It’s right across the river from Manhattan. It’s right next to Brooklyn as well, so it’s kind of a nice location. I also live in Queens. I live in Astoria, which is the neighborhood just north of Long Island City.

0:01:35 Taylor Wilson: Okay. Okay. Are you a big fan of the King of Queens? Did you watch that show?

0:01:40 Jordan Diatlo: No.

0:01:40 Taylor Wilson: Do you get asked that a lot?

0:01:44 Jordan Diatlo: Not really. My parents took my kids to the Ice King of Corona, and I know that that’s, like, in the intro for King of Queens, right?

0:01:53 Taylor Wilson: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

0:01:55 Jordan Diatlo: I think that’s really, like, you know, when it comes to ice cream, that. That’s where I’m like, oh, what are we talking about now? But that’s probably one of my only, like, tidbits that I know about the show. I’m much. When it comes to New York, I’m much more a Seinfeld fan.

0:02:13 Taylor Wilson: Oh, I love Seinfeld. I love Seinfeld. Yeah. So I. I think I was telling you that I drove through. I drove to New York a couple of months ago. Did I tell you about that? And I ended up accidentally getting routed through Brooklyn. I was not supposed to have to go through the city by the gps, but I missed a turn, and I ended up in, like, one and a half, almost two hours of traffic in Brooklyn. Unexpectedly So that was for me, living out in the mountains, like, not a lot of traffic here going on. It was not. It was an. It was an adventure.

0:02:48 Jordan Diatlo: Yeah, yeah. There’s the traffic. You kind of always have to factor in anytime, if you’re driving somewhere, always add a lot of padding for traffic. And parking. If you don’t know in advance the parking situation, you gotta add like a half hour at least.

0:03:05 Taylor Wilson: Well, I’m glad I didn’t have to park, but I can’t imagine where I would have parked because nothing seemed like you could park at anywhere, you know, so. All right, so let’s talk about Leadoff Studio. So you guys are a product, you’re an industrial design firm. So you help entrepreneurs. You work with a lot of entrepreneurs and startups, people who have an idea for physical good a product and they come to you and they say, I’ve got this idea, how do I actually make it? Like, how do I make this product? That’s what you guys do?

0:03:39 Jordan Diatlo: Yeah. So the term is industrial design. That’s the most specific and best way to describe it or label it. It literally means designing for an industry in a way like commercial design. I usually explain it to people. My simplest 101 explanation is it’s architecture. But for everything else, architects do the buildings, industrial designers, construction design, anything else. Now my other simple way of explaining it, Leadoff Studio. We design physical products for businesses to help them launch a new part of their business or launch a new business based around that physical product.

0:04:23 Jordan Diatlo: Like you said, we do work with a ton of entrepreneurs. I’d say that’s the majority of our clients. We also work with some established clients. You know, we’ve done work with Nike and Walmart and Lululemon. But we’ve also helped a lot of really cool startups launch. And I would say Roe is probably one of the more well known ones because we worked with them really when Lead Off Studio was just starting out and they were starting out, but we’ve worked with so many since then.

0:04:57 Jordan Diatlo: I would say that the common thread with all these though, they have an expertise in their field. So with ro, they knew all about the pharmaceutical world. You know, with Lululemon, we were working on their line for Mirror. They knew all about At Home fitness. We recently worked with a company called Babsy that launched Children’s toothbrush. The two founders are two pediatric dentists. They know everything about children’s teeth and oral health.

0:05:30 Jordan Diatlo: The thing that all of these have in common, they don’t have the expertise of how to design and manufacture a physical product or physical good. So that’s really where we come in. We partner with these companies to help them design this three dimensional object that is going to help them capitalize on their business opportunity and really launch their business and start real revenue stream.

0:05:56 Taylor Wilson: Yeah, that’s awesome. Okay, remind me what RO is. I like, it’s so familiar and I can’t remember what they, what’s their product line?

0:06:03 Jordan Diatlo: Right. So RO actually started as Roman and Roman is still around, I believe it’s their. RO is now their umbrella for a couple different brands. When Roman started, I think in 2017 or 18, they’re, they were, and they were one of the first telehealth companies. So they were really this idea of you talking to a doctor on your phone or you text with a doctor and then all of a sudden a shipment. In their case they were, I think they were capitalizing on the expiring patents for Viagra or for erectile dysfunction medication where that was becoming generic and they were able to really deliver that at a much lower expense and really blow out the operational logistics of how to get that to a customer.

0:06:57 Jordan Diatlo: But at the time if medication just shows up at your front door and all you’ve done is text with a doctor and you might feel like, should I actually put this in my mouth and swallow it? Like that’s kind of weird. So we help them with their packaging design and you know what I would say is their onboarding experience for a new customer. It’s really the first time that you’re, you know, when you get this package, it’s the first time that you’re physically interacting with the brand and you’re not going into a pharmacy, you’re not hand to hand receiving this from a pharmacist.

0:07:35 Jordan Diatlo: You’re opening a box. So we really looked at that as a moment to build trust between the company and their customer and you know, make people feel confident that okay, this is, this is real, this came from a real doctor, it’s sealed properly, it has the proper warnings, but it’s also simple enough that somebody can open it and get to it without having to mentally digest tons and tons of information, which that’s something they’re also solving for is just the experience that customers have or patients have of dealing with the medical system is so complex.

0:08:16 Jordan Diatlo: So how can we simplify that and get people the solutions that they actually need?

0:08:21 Taylor Wilson: Yeah, I now remember the Roman commercial. So okay, I like, let’s dig into that. Yeah, yeah. But also thinking about like, like, and, and there’s a lot of those prescription, like subscription for prescription companies. Now you see like hims, hers. A lot of you said that like building trust by the product packaging. So someone’s opening a box and they want. I mean, I would, I’d be like, I didn’t go get this from the pharmacist.

0:08:52 Taylor Wilson: What really is this stuff? You know, I even sometimes think about, I order a lot of supplements on like Amazon and stuff, you know, like my vitamins and stuff. And even sometimes then now a lot of them come with that trust, like verification QR code thing. You can scan, which I like, but sometimes you are like, where did this really come from? And so how did you build trust with a box with like packaging? What kinds of things did you explore when you’re working with your client to say, like, this is what we need to put on the packaging. This is how we build trust through product packaging.

0:09:25 Jordan Diatlo: Yeah. So this was actually a super interesting project and actually it was one of our first projects. The founders came to us before they hired any full time employees and they were just launching this and they didn’t even put it in terms of build trust. That was kind of how we assessed the project. Like, okay, if we’re in the customer’s shoes, what are the emotions going through their head as they’re ordering this medication?

0:09:56 Jordan Diatlo: What are the thoughts and feelings when they actually get it? And we really looked at their core customer of, you know, really targeting men in their 30s and 40s. But I think they’re also getting a lot of men who are probably skewing a little older as well, just because of what the medication is. I think by appealing to the younger end of that spectrum, they’re actually getting the older end of that spectrum. And I think that was totally intentional on their ends.

0:10:29 Taylor Wilson: You know, like the. Maybe the son is like, hey, this is fine, dad. Like I don’t know.

0:10:35 Jordan Diatlo: And actually that. No, it’s interesting you say fathers and sons, but yeah, not in the sharing sense, but in the identity sense. That was actually their first marketing campaign was Ro or Roman is for fathers, sons, husbands, uncles, nephews. Like, it’s just people who are normal people. And a part of their campaign was just destigmatizing erectile dysfunction as well. They’re really trying to get away from like the 90s and early 2000s of like an old guy partying on the beach with like young women kind of vibe. Like that is not the vibe they’re going for.

0:11:17 Jordan Diatlo: This is like a real disorder. And it can actually be, I think their, their Campaigns called it a check engine light. Like if this is happening to you, it could actually be sign that there’s bigger issues at play.

0:11:29 Taylor Wilson: Yeah, yeah.

0:11:32 Jordan Diatlo: So anyway, the way that we designed the box was trying to kind of tap into the voice of what their brand was doing at the time. It’s, it’s not this like Mountain Dew X Games version of like gnarly manliness. It’s just like every man’s like just a guy in his garage who has a family kind of person, you know, just everyday person. So we looked at, we ultimately pulled some inspiration from a chef’s knife roll or like a tool roll that like a carpenter might have something that like unwraps.

0:12:10 Jordan Diatlo: So it has this really clean feel when it’s closed and a very inconspicuous feel when it’s closed as well. I always had the scenario of, you know, your eight year old nephew is at your house and they’re just running around going through all your stuff. You don’t want them to get to this and like think that they should open it. So when it’s closed it should feel really subtle. And then when you open it, it should still feel really simple and organized and kind of walk you through the journey.

0:12:39 Jordan Diatlo: So it unwraps as this package where it has four panels. The first one is just welcome to ro like thank you for taking care of yourself and being proactive. The next one is like a little envelope that has all of the technical information on the inside, but the outside of it is very clean in a way to not overwhelm people. They can go into the envelope and get all that extra information if they need, but they don’t have to.

0:13:10 Jordan Diatlo: The next panel has a prescription label that is a. It’s clean, it’s easy to read, but it is a real prescription label applied by the pharmacist. And then the last part of it is the actual box holding the medication. And that actually has a seal that’s stuck on that the user has to peel off. But the pharmacist is the last person that touches box. So the pharmacist puts that seal on that box as a way to signal the to the consumer.

0:13:41 Jordan Diatlo: Nobody has touched this box except for the pharmacist. The pharmacist packed this and put it in here. So it’s just a way to kind of cue like here’s your journey left to right. And it’s a very easy, like I always say, people don’t really read these things. It’s more of like, can they absorb it really quickly. So even the prescription label says your doctor’s name, says your name. It’s very simple. The typography and hierarchy of everything is designed in a way that the most important stuff is right up front so you can absorb it.

0:14:13 Jordan Diatlo: And then you get to the end and you have to peel that label off in order to get to the medication. And that’s kind of the last like seal of approval there.

0:14:22 Taylor Wilson: Yeah, I love that. It’s a really good story, a really good example of how you have to think about all of these different things that go through somebody’s mind when they are purchasing a product and or using a product. And so it’s as brands, like pulling, you know, like we’re. I always talk about like pulling, pulling the customer into the story or the donor into the story or whoever your audience is into the story.

0:14:47 Taylor Wilson: And this is sort of a way of like you’re really thinking about the psychology of what they’re, what they’re going through with this as they purchase this product. Especially in something that’s more of a sensitive nature like that, where people might feel embarrassed. And so it’s like you’re recognizing that you’re recognizing, hey, like we want this to be clean, simple, not obvious if you open it up in front of your child or something like that.

0:15:08 Taylor Wilson: And then also I love that last bit about it’s like clear communication. I’m a really big fan of Brene Brown’s just simple line of Clearest kind. And I think about that so much in marketing and in design too. And like how that clarity is so important and you’re being kind to the customer by being like the last person that touched this was the pharmacist and that builds that trust. So it’s like all these little details in something that’s a 30 second open the box process at all.

0:15:43 Taylor Wilson: But there’s so much detail that goes into thinking about design of goods and products. I love that example.

0:15:51 Jordan Diatlo: That’s so true. Honestly, the way that a user absorbs this is so subconscious. But it’s these little tiny subconscious moments that all add up to the impression of the brand. And with Ro, they were just starting out. Nobody was ordering medication on their phone. It was really weird. It was this totally different thing. So it was so critical that all of these little moments add up in a way that’s going to get people to say, okay, this was actually easy.

0:16:24 Jordan Diatlo: This actually really helped and impacted my life and I felt comfortable the whole time. So yeah, let me subscribe and get this recurring order which that’s how Ro really was able to build up. And, I mean, the last time I saw their valuation, it’s somewhere in the billions. And they’ve got Serena Williams and Charles Barkley signed up as sponsors. Like, it’s. Yeah, they’re doing all right.

0:16:53 Taylor Wilson: Yeah. Hey, that’s so cool. You were, you were at the beginning of that, so. By the way, I love that you have a Yorkie on your coffee mug for people listening that aren’t watching this. I’m a big fan of dogs.

0:17:12 Jordan Diatlo: I don’t, I don’t have a dog right now, but.

0:17:15 C: I want to get.

0:17:16 Jordan Diatlo: A dog at some point.

0:17:17 Taylor Wilson: It looks like a Yorkie. I don’t know when I was. This is going off on a tangent, but when I was younger, your tutorial, I don’t know, I was probably in second grade or something and, you know, you had to check out a library book every week at school. And I literally got the same one every week for like two months straight. And it was all about dog breeds, every single dog breed. And I read that thing front and back and I knew everything about every single dog breed.

0:17:47 Jordan Diatlo: All right, so when I’m ready to get a dog, I’m going to come back.

0:17:50 Taylor Wilson: Just ask me. You know, I might. I’m going to go back into the ethers of my memory and try to remember, but I. I might know a thing or two for you.

0:17:58 Jordan Diatlo: That’s awesome.

0:17:59 Taylor Wilson: So let’s back up. Let’s talk about how you got into product design. How did you start this company? Like, were you the kid out in the garage tooling around with building things and creating physical things? Like, how did you get into physical good design?

0:18:18 Jordan Diatlo: So I, I mean, growing up, I, I think that’s like a common story for industrial designers. And I’ll say I was the kid on the computer who is like making posters and CD covers. And like, I, I was all about like making mixtapes or mix cd. So putting stickers on those and trying to label them and brand them. I was a hundred percent graphic design. And when I went to college, I went to a school called Carnegie Mellon University.

0:18:52 Jordan Diatlo: Their program is a design program. And they put the communication design, which is their word for graphic design and the industrial design in the same class freshman year. So you just come in as design. I was 100%. Doesn’t even cover it. I was so, so sure I was going to be a graphic designer. And just, you know, that was my dream. That freshman year, they really exposed us to both graphic design and industrial design. And every time we did A graphic design project.

0:19:25 Jordan Diatlo: I was like, this is not fun. I don’t like it. Every time we did an industrial design project, it like scratched this itch that I didn’t know that I even had the ability to do. 3D. Problem solving was like this whole new cool thing that I guess I probably was doing it a lot growing up and just not even realizing it, but kind of organizing that thought for me by putting that curriculum together. I think by the end of that freshman year when we had to declare a major, I was like, wow, I can’t believe this, but I’m going to go id.

0:20:06 Jordan Diatlo: I’m giving up the graphic part. I’m doing id. I’m going all the way. And then from there, you know, I graduated. I again, I was like 100% sure I want to be a footwear designer. I actually got my first job, a company called Stephen Barry’s that was famous for doing these $20 basketball, like on court shoes that Stephon Marbury, who I think at the time was on the Knicks, but he, he’s all star in the NBA for many years and he’s from New York, he’s from Brooklyn, Coney island. And he sponsored the Starberry shoe that they had. And that really put them on the map. And they were expanding. I got to do some shoes for Venus Williams and a few other celebrity lines that they were doing.

0:20:55 Jordan Diatlo: But, well, honestly I got, I got laid off after six months. They went bust very quickly. The $20 shoe model didn’t really work.

0:21:07 Taylor Wilson: I guess I was thinking that seems like that could be hard.

0:21:11 Jordan Diatlo: Yeah, I think it was. I think they were going on razor thin margins and trying to expand too fast. I got another job in footwear design. And you know, between those two jobs, I did a internship at an industrial design studio. And when I compared those three experiences, the industrial design studio was hands down the one that felt the most comfortable and the most like, this is what I want to do, this is where I want to be.

0:21:35 Jordan Diatlo: Unfortunately, I was not good enough to get a full time job there. Like not even close. So they didn’t offer me one. I was able to eventually get a little bit of freelance work. I quit the footwear design job just based on like probably like five hours of freelance work a week. And then kind of just started to build from there. Eventually I got a job at a place called Quirky that was a startup that was doing invention submissions by everyday people.

0:22:07 Jordan Diatlo: They were kind of weaving together a couple trends happening at the time, crowdsourcing being one of them. They came out the same time as Kickstarter. Also just community building online. They had a really active message board of all these people that were into inventing and design. And Quirky had this pipeline where they would select a new invention to put into their design feed every week. So we were getting tons and tons of work. It was like, I mean it was like grad school on steroids working there. And because it was a startup, it just gave me the room to step in and do tons and tons of work. I grew super fast, honed my skills super fast, became a lead designer or senior designer after about one year.

0:22:55 Jordan Diatlo: They sent me to China a bunch of times to work with factories. All in all, I worked there for three years and probably designed over 60 products. I think 20 of them actually got put into market with, were sold in stores. So it was just crazy, crazy learning experience. And that’s probably the experience that I take the most out of in terms of running lead off studio and how we operate there, operate here.

0:23:21 Jordan Diatlo: Not that we’re doing the crazy quantity, but just the, all the different skills that I learned there, I put together and used that to run lead off. After I worked at Quirky, I bounced around a lot and did a lot of freelance work on my own as well. And the freelance work working directly with the clients was what really spoke to me the most. I did take a couple full time jobs during that time, got laid off from the last one that I ever worked at and that was about like two or three weeks before my first kid was born.

0:24:02 Jordan Diatlo: So it was a crazy time and I just felt like, okay, I can’t. My, my, my daughter is about to be born. I can’t go back to another startup. I can’t go back to that risk. Let me bet on myself and let me try this for real. It’s not just going to be freelance. Let me really try to make this into a business and start it up. And that was almost 10 years ago. So.

0:24:26 C: So.

0:24:29 Taylor Wilson: It’S a journey. It’s a journey. I love that. That’s, it’s gotta be really cool to see things that you just. I know I feel this, but everything I’m really working in is more in the digital space. So like I’m in the graphic design part of it. But it’s so cool when you see something come to life. But I can imagine, I don’t just, you know, I don’t, I know nothing about what you do and it fascinates me.

0:24:52 Taylor Wilson: I can just imagine like designing a product and then seeing it in stores on Shelves. How cool that is to see something come to life and how impactful it is when you think about, especially if you’re working with people like the dentist that, you know, pediatric dentists have an idea for a better toothbrush. They come to you, you help them make it and then they start seeing it on shelves. That’s gotta be really fun.

0:25:19 Jordan Diatlo: Can I tell you that the best part of that one because that one got released about like three months ago. So now we’re really starting to.

0:25:27 Taylor Wilson: What’s it called again? It’s called again Bap C Bapsy B.

0:25:32 Jordan Diatlo: A B S Y. Okay. So they’re starting to see a little momentum, which is super exciting. I mean, I know that this is going to hit. We’ve all kind of known it all along because every time we’re playing with prototypes here, the adults get excited.

0:25:50 C: Yeah.

0:25:51 Jordan Diatlo: I, I brought home some like just plain white 3D prints, no graphics on it or anything. And my kids, I brought it home so I could see if my kids, my 3 year old son at, he was 3 at the time, if he had the dexterity to put it together.

0:26:09 Taylor Wilson: Yeah.

0:26:10 Jordan Diatlo: What I found was that my son and my daughter were fighting over these parts and they’re not the type of siblings who are fighting all the time. So the fact that they were fighting over these plain white 3D print toothbrush, I was like, yeah. Oh my God, I think we have a hit. Like this is. This is gonna be.

0:26:28 Taylor Wilson: I’m googling it. How do I find it? Going to the wrong website and everything. I’m looking for maybe toothbrush.

0:26:35 Jordan Diatlo: So I’ll. Their website is brushbabsy.com.

0:26:42 Taylor Wilson: Okay. We’ll put it in the show.

0:26:43 Jordan Diatlo: Check it out. Studios website leadoffstudio.com build a brush weed. Com Babsey Build your brush.

0:26:54 Taylor Wilson: Hey, this is cool. So I can see how kids would have really like, it’s like build a bear, but build your brush. And then it makes it fun to like have your toothbrush that you custom made.

0:27:07 Jordan Diatlo: Yeah. In terms of like what you were asking about seeing on shelves, I will say this one has been so rewarding because Babsie posts these videos that people send them onto their Instagram. So we actually get to watch kids unboxing Babsy. Like not like a YouTuber unboxing it and giving their thoughts. There’s like real kids and it’s like a toothbrush but they’re opening it as if it’s like a birthday present.

0:27:36 Jordan Diatlo: And it’s awesome because that’s really the whole point of the product. And Babsy. Babsy came to us. Dante and Zach, the two dentists. What they said to us was, you know, parents ask us every day, what toothbrush should I buy my kid? And the answer that always surprised the parents was, just get them whatever toothbrush will get them to brush their teeth. You don’t need to get them, like, sonic vibration, whatever. You don’t need an app, you don’t need any tech.

0:28:08 Jordan Diatlo: You just really need your kids to brush their teeth more often and for longer. And so their idea was, let’s create something that the kids put together through our design process of coming up with tons of ideas, presenting some of those, then narrowing it down to some, and we prototype and render some of those ideas. We actually sit there and play with the prototypes. Like I said, I gave it to my kids to play with to test out.

0:28:36 Jordan Diatlo: I know the dentist. They gave it to their kids to test out. We help narrow it down to one idea and then we refine, refine, refine until it’s ready to get manufactured, and then we help our clients manufacture as well.

0:28:49 Taylor Wilson: Yeah, I have someone who I want to send one of these to now. This is really cool. Yeah, Yeah, I like that. Simple. Just like, what will a kid use? Like, just brush your teeth. You know, it doesn’t have to be complicated, but this makes them want to, like, feel proud about their toothbrush.

0:29:06 Jordan Diatlo: It’s another one where it’s. It’s all about the subconscious details of it when you’re using it. So for a kid, they’re constantly trying to figure out, what’s my identity, who am I, what do I like? So with Babsie, we designed all these different parts that they can combine together. It’s basically, we call them bits. So I’ll explain for the listening audience. There’s a rod on the inside of this construction. The kids start with a rod, they twist the brush onto the top, and then there’s room for three or four of these bits to get twisted onto the rod. It’s a threaded rod, so it’s really easy to use.

0:29:50 Jordan Diatlo: We designed it really inspired by cognitive building toys that kids use when they’re toddlers purposefully. So it’s easy to put it together because if kids can put it together, they’ll take it apart and put it together again and take it apart and put it together again. It helps build their confidence each time that they do that, and they get really comfortable using it and get really interested in using it and really proud of the fact that they built it and the Other part of figuring out, who am I? What’s my identity?

0:30:24 Jordan Diatlo: They’re always changing what they like. They’re always changing what they’re into. So Babsy comes with this whole set of all these different bits that they can take on and take off and switch out and trade with their siblings. There’s all these options. So, you know, we kind of always talk about my son in this way. Like, you know, at first he really liked the dinosaur feet bit, but now that’s a little too baby for him. And now he wants, like, the alien video game bit.

0:30:53 Jordan Diatlo: So he just, like, swaps out these different things as he goes, but it’s still his toothbrush. And as a parent, I love it because we’re not throwing out a whole, like, plastic and rubber toothbrush or we’re not throwing out an electric toothbrush. Every time he decides, oh, I don’t like this anymore. I don’t like. Yeah. Which is what we were doing before. And I think.

0:31:18 C: How come I watched you?

0:31:19 Jordan Diatlo: I was just saying, oh, you came.

0:31:21 C: To that with Babsy. You can swap out these parts.

0:31:23 Taylor Wilson: It’s okay.

0:31:24 C: Which is what we were doing this way. As a parent, I really like that because I hate throwing out the entire toothbrush just because, you know, my son doesn’t like Ninja Turtles anymore, so he won’t use his Ninja Turtle toothbrush. And we bought him this Ninja Turtle electric toothbrush, but now he won’t brush his teeth because it has a Ninja Turtle on it.

0:31:47 Taylor Wilson: Yeah.

0:31:47 C: And he just decides that now he likes Ghostbusters. Now he doesn’t like Ghostbusters. By the way, I love Ninja Turtles and Ghostbusters.

0:31:56 Jordan Diatlo: No.

0:31:56 C: No shame thrown at those. Those guys.

0:32:00 Taylor Wilson: Yeah. My son. Yeah. I mean, who doesn’t. Yeah, yeah. Who? I. I think we’re about the same age they were of our time. No, it’s really cool. I like how you can buy the. I’m looking at the website, how you can buy all these expansion packs. And so what’s interesting about this is as y’ all are designing this, you’re thinking through all these different use cases and, like, exactly what you’re talking about. Kids get tired of their toothbrush.

0:32:31 Taylor Wilson: I don’t want to have to throw away the head and, like, get a whole new thing. Let’s just have a replaceable head. If they want a new design, they’re into something different. You can buy these expansion packs, and they have all these different types of designs and characters and this look, this is really fun. And again, it’s like thinking about the Audience. The kid. The kid is the audience. And I mean the parent wants to buy something for their kid. But it sounds a lot like this buyer behavior is heavily influenced.

0:32:59 C: I can get by the kids 10 minutes in the morning, one team to get behind something because I’m not chasing my kids around trying to get them to brush their teeth and yeah, 10 minutes just to do something that honestly, they’ll only do it for like 30 seconds anyway.

0:33:14 Jordan Diatlo: That.

0:33:15 C: That’s huge. That’s huge. That’s like one less stress in the.

0:33:18 Jordan Diatlo: Morning and at night. Like the.

0:33:20 C: I think that’s really the buy in from parents. Like, oh, my kids actually using this. And I don’t have to chase them down or make them do it. That’s. That’s really where the power is.

0:33:39 Taylor Wilson: Yeah. Awesome. Okay, so we’ve gone in some interesting directions today. We’ve talked about a row and getting started with a prescription online prescription pharmacy for Ed. Wasn’t expecting to talk about that. Talked about how you got into this and now we’re talking about kids. Toothbrush is being designed. I want to do something fun and last 10, 5, 10 minutes or so. So this is kind of. Can we, can we do something kind of funny? I want to talk about what it would be like to.

0:34:11 Taylor Wilson: Let’s, let’s make believe that I have an idea for a product and I’m coming to you and I’m saying this is my great idea. How do we, how do we build it from start to finish? And this is my, this is the funny part. So my husband and I like to like laugh about ridiculous products that we could invent that just like don’t even do anything, but they’re just funny sounding. And one of the ones that he came up with is a bean polisher.

0:34:39 Taylor Wilson: So like I buy, you know, to buy like just like the beans and bags, not like the canned stuff, but like then you soak them and you make them and everything like that. But what if you could polish your beans? What if this was something people actually cared about and would buy the bean polisher? I want to design a bean polisher, Jordan. I have no idea what I’m doing, but I think this is going to make millions and get me on Shark Tank and do all of the things. Like what would be our first step together in working on developing the bean polisher?

0:35:12 C: That’s awesome.

0:35:15 Jordan Diatlo: I have a, I have a book.

0:35:17 C: That I need to send you.

0:35:18 Taylor Wilson: We come up with a lot of dumb ideas like that. We say the dumber the better.

0:35:22 C: There’s like kind of A subculture of like products like that in Japan. In Japan, it’s like a thing where people come up with like ridiculous products that just over designed over engineered products to just do like the simplest thing that like you don’t actually need a product for. So I’ll have to send you that after this. All right, so. So for a bean shining product, I think we will want to understand I.

0:35:50 Taylor Wilson: Want shiny beans before I want my beans to show.

0:35:55 C: Create this product for. So totally understand the problem. Your beans aren’t shining. Right. Solution, let’s figure out how to get there. But we need to know who are we solving this for? Do you, how much do you kind.

0:36:11 Jordan Diatlo: Of know about the problem?

0:36:12 C: Are they shining beans in their kitchen? Are they shining them somewhere else in their house? Maybe they get shined at the grocery store and this is more of a commercial product instead of at home product. But we kind of want to know how much you know or how much you’re kind of planning for your business. I mean, this is the thing when somebody comes to us with a product idea. One of the most important parts of my vetting process is making sure that somebody is thinking about starting a business that is going to last for a long time.

0:36:46 C: Because I know that we are one of the first pieces of that puzzle. But I don’t want to design something for somebody that they’re going to spend all this money with us and then not be able to recoup that and make more money off of that investment. We want people to be able to start a business. So we really want to understand what are all the business aspects of the bean shining business. But then, okay, so let’s say you answer all of those questions flawlessly.

0:37:18 C: I would say, okay, let’s schedule a kickoff meeting. We’re going to kick off the project. So Taylor, you would probably come into our studio if you’re in the New York area or sometimes we do this over zoom. But we like to have a meeting with you and the entire design team here where you kind of talk through.

0:37:36 Jordan Diatlo: The, you know, the who, what, where.

0:37:38 C: When, why of your product and really just tell us all the research and all the work that you’ve done already. I always like doing this because I think it’s important for the design team to actually meet the founders, actually understand the emotional journey that you’ve been on to get to this point so far, because it really is an emotional journey. And then it’s also good for you, the founder to understand, well, who’s actually working on my product, like, you know, we’re not like a faceless corporation. We’re a room full of people who are really passionate about design.

0:38:14 C: Really, really passionate about helping people. Just really passionate about making great things. Okay, so kickoff meeting goes well. The team over here, then, you know, we kind of take a couple weeks. We do internal brainstorming. We might go out shopping. Sometimes we buy things, sometimes we’re just browsing, but really do all these things to feed our minds, to understand. Like, okay, where can we pull ideas for bean shining? Maybe we look at shoe shining. Maybe we look at, you know, car washes. Maybe we look at other tools, spur vegetables. Maybe we’re going to Sur La Tab and going through all the different kitchen gadgets there.

0:38:57 Jordan Diatlo: Right.

0:38:57 C: Doing all that. And what I like to encourage people to do is just take a little bit of paper with you when you do that and just like doodle down a couple ideas.

0:39:06 Taylor Wilson: Yeah.

0:39:06 C: So when you come back to the studio now, you can make those ideas a little larger. And then I always kind of throw out the number. Let’s get 50 ideas on the wall. And these ideas don’t all have to be great, but we need to get a lot of ideas in order to have a bunch of good ideas. Ultimately, we’re working towards refining those enough where we could show you 10 or so different ways that your bean shining business based around your bean shining product could go.

0:39:36 C: And we’re usually present.

0:39:48 Taylor Wilson: Or do you start doing, like little 3D modeling?

0:39:50 C: Like, what we usually do is just hand, like prototypes. We do a lot of pen and marker sketching. It’s a really fast way to show you and visualize for you, the client, what your business could look like with this product. And by visualizing the product, it helps you in your head think about, okay, if I did this type of product, this is how I could take my business. If I did that type of product, maybe my business would look like this. Maybe it would be more about the bean production.

0:40:20 Jordan Diatlo: They’re getting shined.

0:40:21 C: Maybe this one’s like just at home, somebody’s shining, you know, a small amount of beans. Maybe it’s one bean at a time. There’s all different ways you can solve this problem.

0:40:31 Jordan Diatlo: Right.

0:40:32 C: So we want you to start to visualize that with the 10 ideas. And I just kind of use 10 as a round number. Sometimes it’s more, sometimes it’s less. But the hand sketches also make it. So now you are pulled into the process. Right. If we showed you a 3D rendering, it feels very final, it feels very polished and finished. You’re not always as the client, especially one who might not be familiar with design, you might not be comfortable telling us, hey, this is no good. Or what we really want is, I like this, but let’s change this.

0:41:07 C: Let’s modify it this way or that way. The sketches really pull people into the process by showing you something that is purposefully not fully polished. It’s not a fully baked idea. At this point, we want our clients to come in and lend their expertise. I mean, in this scenario, you’re probably a bean expert that’s coming in with this business opportunity. Nice. And while, sure we all enjoy beans.

0:41:34 Jordan Diatlo: Here, we don’t have that expertise that’s.

0:41:36 C: As deep as yours.

0:41:36 Jordan Diatlo: So I will tell you.

0:41:41 C: We want you to come in and lend that expertise to the process. And that’s how we kind of collaborate. Now then there. Ultimately we’re asking you to pick three of those ideas. Sometimes more, sometimes less. Again, round numbers here, but we’ll actually take that. And now we’ll start to bring them into the computer and make 3D models. We’ll do 3D rendering and we’ll also actually make prototypes. So sometimes that’s 3D printed prototypes, sometimes it’s just prototypes that are made in our modest, small New York City wood shop over here, which honestly barely uses wood.

0:42:17 C: A lot of times we just make like quick cardboard mock ups or foam core mockups. But those are really powerful because it actually puts the design for the first time on the table in front of you, the client. Now you can see the actual scale of your invention idea. You can hold it, you can actually step through the motions of trying to use it, whether it works or whether you’re pretending. But we can actually act out that user experience.

0:42:45 C: And then the renderings paired with that help give the vision of where this is going. Now from there we ask that you will pick one because now we need to really focus this in. And that’s where we really go in and refine, refine, refine. We’ll do all the refinement, we’ll do all the engineering work, get this ready for manufacturing. And then once you sign off, then we’ll start sourcing manufacturers for you.

0:43:09 C: We’ll lead that whole process if you need to, basically up until this thing is ready for production. And we say, Taylor, it’s ready. You gotta press the green button to go on production. And then.

0:43:27 Jordan Diatlo: Yeah, exactly. Oh, absolutely.

0:43:33 Taylor Wilson: Like the bean visionary. And I don’t have to.

0:43:35 C: Absolutely.

0:43:36 Taylor Wilson: I don’t have to know all this stuff. You guys pull me along.

0:43:38 C: They, yeah, I’ve learned a lot about.

0:43:40 Jordan Diatlo: The product design process along the way.

0:43:43 C: Yeah, I mean, yeah, you can even. They’ve left us some very nice reviews. You can see they will still be working with us because they, they also have seen through the process just how difficult the product development process can be. They’re experts in dentistry, they’re experts in oral health and how to treat children with their oral health issues. They can’t be experts in product design as well, just like I’m not a dentist.

0:44:13 C: So it’s important to find the right collaborators, I think.

0:44:18 Taylor Wilson: Yeah, right. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I think it’s fascinating. I mean it’s, it’s one of those things. It’s like I, you, you, you get used to doing something and you sometimes forget that maybe what you do is fascinating to other people. And so I love meeting someone in a. Who’s in design but in a completely different type of design and like brand building than what we do. Because like I can think about websites all day long and like logos and brand identity. But when it comes to thinking about like what you do, I’m like usually took this idea and that like made this thing that I hold in my hand and I use.

0:45:02 C: It’s always fun when our clients are.

0:45:04 Taylor Wilson: Actually that to me is like.

0:45:08 C: Wolf Gordon. They’re awesome like textile design company and you know, they’ve brought us in to be essentially their 3D design team anytime they need three dimensional design that they work with. So it’s really cool. Yeah. Oh no.

0:45:32 Taylor Wilson: Cool.

0:45:32 Jordan Diatlo: We made so much.

0:45:33 Taylor Wilson: Cool.

0:45:34 C: Well, we made so much.

0:45:35 Taylor Wilson: Well, I have a real product idea actually maybe I’ll talk to you about sometime. And it’s not the bean polisher. That one I’m not so sure we’ve got a market for. I don’t, I don’t really. Yeah, I don’t really know what the market is in bean polishing, but you never know. It’s a weird world. It could come around sometime. Jordan, what do you want people to know about you? How can people find you?

0:45:57 C: Follow us on Instagram.

0:45:58 Taylor Wilson: How can they get in touch with Leadoff Studio if they have.

0:46:01 C: Go to our website, leadoffstudio.com there’s a form fill on our website. You can always reach out that goes directly to me or you can reach out infoeadoffstudio.com Email me. Yeah, that’s the best way. That’s how a lot of people get in touch with us.

0:46:19 Jordan Diatlo: Yeah.

0:46:27 Taylor Wilson: Awesome. Awesome. Well, I like that you’re a boutique enough experience where people can talk directly to you and you can help them solve their problems. And I seriously do have idea for something.

0:46:38 C: Getting to work with people who are.

0:46:40 Taylor Wilson: Come back around to that sometime with you, my friend.

0:46:43 C: They’re passionate about the industry. We’re working with some people right now who are just super passionate golfers doing a really cool golf product. I mean, we get to work with people who are passionate about all different things and it’s really cool to help them with their journey to bring a product to life.

0:47:11 Taylor Wilson: That’s awesome. Well, thanks so much for being on the show and for spending some time with me today. I hope this was helpful. If you’ve ever thought about a product idea, maybe something as good, I know not quite as good. It’s going to be hard to be as good as the bean polisher. But if you have a product idea and you really have a legitimate business idea, I definitely suggest you reach out to Jordan and lead off studio.

0:47:34 Taylor Wilson: And until next time, my friends, go get all your good shizzle done.