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Building Mobile Fundraising Apps: Kathy Kempff’s Journey and Insights

• Taylor Shanklin

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About the Guest(s):

Kathy Kempff is the founder of Nuclavis, a company that specializes in creating mobile fundraising solutions for nonprofits. With over 25 years of experience in the nonprofit sector, Kathy has developed a keen understanding of the needs of these organizations. Her focus is on delivering custom app solutions that enhance donor engagement and community building. Kathy is known for her innovative approach to product development, taking insights from her deep industry knowledge and utilizing data to refine and improve her offerings.

Episode Summary:

In this episode of Talking Shizzle, host Taylor Wilson sits down with Kathy Kempff, the visionary founder of Nuclavis. They explore the journey of building and launching a mobile fundraising platform in the nonprofit sector.Packed with plenty of insights, particularly for entrepreneurs and leaders looking to take a product to market efficiently and effectively. Kathy shares her experiences and the strategies she used to build a successful company in a niche market, highlighting the significance of listening to customer needs and leveraging partnerships.

Kathy speaks about her process of taking Nuclavis from concept to a thriving business within two years. She underscores the importance of balancing data with instinct in product development and talks about the pivotal role partnerships played in scaling her business. Listeners gain valuable knowledge on how to navigate product launches, refine ideas based on user feedback, and maintain brand consistency across various touchpoints. Kathy's pragmatic advice serves as a guide for startups aiming to carve out a niche in competitive industries.

Key Takeaways:

  • The strategic importance of forming partnerships and how they can significantly contribute to business growth and client retention.
  • The role of data and instinct in product development and how to effectively balance both to refine and enhance offerings.
  • Leveraging customer feedback and market demands to shape and innovate your product features for better market fit.
  • How to identify market gaps through active listening and aligning product development with customer needs.
  • Bootstrapping tips for technology startups that emphasize mindful resource allocation and intentional business growth.

Resources:

The episode is packed with actionable insights and inspiring anecdotes that promise to guide listeners in navigating product development and market entry with confidence. Don’t miss this chance to learn from Kathy Kempff’s journey and subscribe for more episodes filled with innovative business growth strategies.

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0:00:03 Taylor Wilson: Hey, hey, hey, all you lovely people out there. I know you’ve got a lot going on in your day, and you have big dreams for your brand. Are you ready to talk some shizzle and learn some shizzle from entrepreneurs, leaders, change makers, and overall interesting people who like to shake things up? I’m your host, Taylor Wilson, founder of Creative Shizzle, and I’m stoked to bring you a fresh episode of Talking Shizzle today. 

0:00:33 Taylor Wilson: This show is all about helping you think differently so that you could grow your business or your cause. Check us out on the web t creativeshizzle.com now let’s get into it and talk some shizzle. Hey, hey, hey, Talking Shizzle Studio fans, today I sat down with Kathy Kemp. Kathy is a good friend of mine, and she is the founder of Nuclavis, and they are building mobile fundraising solutions to help nonprofits connect with their audience of donors and event participants and engage more, create more community and conversations and ultimately raise more money for awesome causes. 

0:01:18 Taylor Wilson: So in today’s episode, Kathy and I sat down and we talked all about building a product and taking it to market. Because Kathy started her product in 2023 and launched her product to market in 2020, she has taken off, and it’s been just amazing to watch her growth. So she has really awesome feedback and tips and advice on how to think about taking a new product to market, how to sort of, like, not make some of the mistakes that are common mistakes when taking a product to market, and ultimately, like, how to get customer feedback and, like, put that into your product. So I hope you enjoy this episode. 

0:01:59 Taylor Wilson: Here we go with Kathy. What is up, Kathy? 

0:02:07 Kathy Kempff: Very fast year. I’m so excited to be here. And as you know, as a startup founder and business owner, time is of essence. You know, building products, getting them to market. Time goes by really quickly, but it can also be a lot of fun. 

0:02:21 Taylor Wilson: Okay, so you built Nuclavis, you launched Nuclavis, like, really launched to market your new app and your mobile fundraising platform. And what was it? 20? Early 2022? 

0:02:32 Kathy Kempff: 2023. So it’s just two years. 

0:02:35 Taylor Wilson: Yeah. Okay, so less than two years, you have a fully custom app solution, and you’ve got all of these other pathways that you have put mobile apps into. Tons of organizations who aren’t, like, on the custom path. Tell me a little bit about your journey in two years, which is, like, astounds me. You, like, have all these apps in market now, and it’s not just, like, one mobile solution in two years. Like, tell me a little bit about your Journey at Nickelobis. 

0:03:13 Kathy Kempff: So I’ve been in the space for about 25 years and have incredible passion for peer to peer and nonprofits specifically. I had left my last position and took about a year off and knew I wanted to dabble in something nonprofit, but I didn’t know what. And so at about that year, Mark, I decided to start reaching out to folks that I knew in the space and understand where there was demand. So I initially had a different product idea, but I ended up getting pulled into build me a better mobile app. And that was the consistent theme that I heard from nonprofits that I had worked with in the past. 

0:03:57 Kathy Kempff: And there wasn’t a lot of competition in the space. And so there was really a hunger for something better, something more modern and a more white glove service approach. Right. A lot of times you can just sell software and you contact customers at renewal. But the nonprofit space is really different. Right. They really require a lot of support throughout the process. They’re thinly staffed. And so there’s really an appreciation and desire for turnkey solutions that include just do it for me, like license, product license, and just do it for me. 

0:04:32 Kathy Kempff: And so we took about five to six months to develop an mvp. You know, I really do think that that is so important to understand what the market wants. Help the market define your roadmap rather than you blindly thinking these are the priorities and these are the feature set that work. And I reached out to a couple of organizations that I knew in the space and offered them a pilot program at no cost in exchange for marketing. Right. And I think that’s so important when you go to market, is having some successes under your belt so that people don’t first. Right. Like, it’s definitely something that, you know you’re not going to be making money on, but I find that it’s really effective. 

0:05:19 Kathy Kempff: I had two people that we had partnered with and it’s also important to pick the right type of folks, you know, folks that are going to provide, you know, that collaborative experience, really constructive feedback and help you make the product better. And are they really representing the market as a whole rather than, oh, this is a niche use case and no one else is really going to use that. And so I actually had my big product launch two years ago, as I mentioned, at this big conference that was specifically for this set of organizations. 

0:05:55 Kathy Kempff: And I had a case study and I had those customers there and they were able to share like, oh yeah, the product is great. And by the way, you can check it out on my phone. Was it Full of bells and whistles. Was it, you know, fully built out? Absolutely not. But it was good enough. It was good enough to demonstrate, you know, we could raise money. It could be a modern technology that’s native that would solve some of these nonprofits problems. And so I think that really allowed us to start developing that trust and interest in folks to be like, oh, I’m going to, I’m going to watch for what they’re doing and really help us accelerate that customer growth over the last two years. So a lot of continued development, you know, it’s never done with software. It’s you know, an iterative process, especially mobile changes so much, whether it’s Android or Apple making changes and new OS versions that you need to be compliant with. 

0:06:54 Kathy Kempff: It really is something that you need to constantly be innovating in order to make sure that you are still delivering, you know, that value to the customers that you’re working with. 

0:07:04 Taylor Wilson: Yeah, one of the things, first off, I really like your approach around giving it away for free to get some of those testimonials and marketing and like success stories. So it’s not just like hey, here I, here we are with our idea. It’s going to be great. You’re like giving it the opportunity to really be put into action and have clients and customers tell other people about what it’s like. So I think that’s really, really smart. I also really like your advice around like it’s not gonna be perfect but like launched is better than perfect because once you get it out there then you can iterate on it. 

0:07:40 Taylor Wilson: It’s hard though, cause like you’re like oh but this one more thing. But this one more thing. But this one more thing. But then like that costs you a lot of time and money and one of the things that I’ve been so impressed by is you’ve got these custom white labeled solutions, you know, kind of like white glove solutions. But then you also went to partners in your market and found all of these like white labeled opportunities too where it’s like other softw companies who don’t have this specific mobile technology can create a custom solution for their clients and platform. 

0:08:11 Taylor Wilson: And so you’ve really been able to like grow rapidly I think because you put so much thought into like your partner strategy as well. Like what would you say went into that? So you sort of like launched the first iteration and got some key clients to use it. Tell me a little bit more about your partner strategy. 

0:08:33 Kathy Kempff: So I think a big element is trying to see holistically what the opportunity as a whole and not necessarily thinking about what do other people do? But if we had no barriers, if we had unlimited time and money, how deep could you sell this product? Is it a global solution? Could the same solution be applied to different aspects of the market? And so while I had a lot of deep relationships in the nonprofit space, I wanted to make sure that partners and agencies were recommending us, were trying to use our solutions as they were trying to provide value to their own customers. 

0:09:13 Kathy Kempff: And so I spent a lot of time with, okay, who are the top 10 partners that are strong influencers in the space? How can I build relationships with them? How can I deepen the partnership? Whether it’s sponsoring their conferences, showing up at their conferences, creating a white label solution for them, building a case study with a joint customer, doing a webinar, how could I give something to them that it would give them a reason to want to work with me? 

0:09:43 Kathy Kempff: It’s not just what am I taking, but what am I giving? I think that that’s such an important part of the partnership component. I have probably 25 to 30% of my business is referrals through partners, which just comes from investing in those relationships and making sure that they see value for me in particular, one of the things that we position is if your customers use our product, they’re raising more money. 

0:10:09 Kathy Kempff: All of them are making money off transaction revenue. So there’s something in it for them. Because their customers are more successful, they’re raising more money. Win, win for both of us. And so we actually recently launched our benchmark report that has some of these stats that help provide, you know, how do we measure the value? What’s the impact, what’s the roi? And I share that with not just prospects, but also the partners, because they want their customers happy, raising more money and sticky. They want them to stay on their platform. 

0:10:38 Kathy Kempff: And so that has been, you know, definitely another big component. And not being tied to North America, I think that’s another big piece is a lot of the other providers have been US and Canada only. But there’s a whole world out there. There’s so much fundraising in Australia, Europe. We already support multilingual. So currently exploring, you know, a couple of prospects in Europe and Australia and potentially increasing our staffing overseas helps those relationships. And really, like, could you double your revenue if you drop those geographical barriers to allow us serve the greater good? 

0:11:18 Taylor Wilson: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, the world is flat, you know, right? Like Thomas Friedman. I don’t know if you’ve read that book, but yeah, we Live in a global economy these days, and with the Internet and with the way that, like, technology works, there’s no reason. I’ve been thinking about that too, with, like, what are other markets where, you know, like. And particularly I noticed this because we were both at that same fundraising conference last week where we saw each other, and there’s a lot going on in Australia. 

0:11:47 Taylor Wilson: And I keep seeing a lot of Australian companies come to these nonprofit tech conferences more and more. I’ve noticed over the last couple of years, like, I’m meeting a lot more Australians, so there’s definitely room for growth when you look outside. Just like the US And Canada, which is kind of. I think people get, like, blinders on and they get, like, a little bit myopic. 

0:12:08 Kathy Kempff: If you’ve already invested in developing a product and all you have to do is enable a language or enable changing how you display the currency sign or something as silly as that, why wouldn’t you expand to a whole other market if you can have such a lift in revenue? I definitely think sometimes we just artificially create these barriers around us in terms of what the market potential is, but. 

0:12:33 Taylor Wilson: It’S really unlimited, especially with, like, markets where English is the common language. Like, there’s a lot of those too. Even just from, like, a sales perspective, like, for you and stuff, and your team. Plus AI can translate anything now. So, like, it’s easier and easier to do. You know, it’s getting a lot easier to do. Okay, so I want to talk a little bit about finding gaps in the market. Like, how do you go about solving problems or identifying problems that need solving? 

0:13:04 Kathy Kempff: I think the first thing is listening, and it’s talking to the customers or prospects in that space and really understanding, like, what are the problems, what is currently working, what’s not working, where are their opportunities, and making sure that you’re doing your homework on, like, what else is available? And is this maybe something that can be solved in a creative way? You don’t always have to be first to market, but you could always be entering the market with this keen eye on how can I do something better and different to solve whatever this market is? 

0:13:43 Kathy Kempff: And I think I can give you a really good example. When I was going to market and we were getting demand for building a mobile app, I was really listening to this consistent theme of customers saying, I would love to have a single destination for everything. Like, why would I need to have a different app for each of my different brands when we are one brand, right? We are Organization xyz, and we might have Sub brands within those. But we don’t necessarily want to have different apps. 

0:14:17 Kathy Kempff: And so when we were architecting our product, we really took that to heart to making sure, like, let’s look at this as a greater vision. We could still do a small sub app if that’s what they chose. But if we’re truly trying to solve this organizational fundraising app demand and requirement, that really was a fundamental architectural decision we need to make. Day one. Ultimately, that’s paid off and it was something that nobody else had done. 

0:14:45 Kathy Kempff: But if I hadn’t been really listening closely to customers right at the beginning, in terms of what was the market need, what was the demand that they wanted, we would have missed the mark. And I would say that’s probably one of our greatest selling selling points today. 

0:15:00 Taylor Wilson: Okay, so first I want to take a step back and just sort of like explain that for people who maybe don’t know what it is. So in that context, it’s like an organization that’s using your mobile fundraising technology, like app platform to create app experiences for all these different types of events that they’re hosting, as opposed to just like, maybe before you guys launched this, they had to go and like build separate apps for every single event they hosted. 

0:15:30 Taylor Wilson: And now you’re saying we’re going to approach it from the brand level, knowing you’ve got all these different events that you’re running that are, you know, marketing, fundraising, community building events, one app, they’re all kind of the same, but they’re unique because they have different participants and audiences in it. Is that it? 

0:15:49 Kathy Kempff: Exactly. It’s almost like micro apps within a, you know, umbrella app so that you can still have your individual brand at maybe the event level. But their most valuable asset is their organizational brand. And so how do we maintain that over the course of the relationship so that they know organizationally who they are rather than just that sub brand? 

0:16:15 Taylor Wilson: Yeah, yeah. So let’s like take for example, we’ll talk about like Alzheimer’s. They’re a good friend of ours. So Alzheimer’s association, they’re the Alzheimer’s Association. In their mobile app, they’re going to be able to have people sign up and do their walk to end Alzheimer’s. They’ll also be able to sign up for the longest day and like they’ve got a cycle event. Right. So like all of those sort of like have the Alzheimer’s brand at the top of it, but then within each event experience, they’ve got like a localized kind of like micro brand for that event within the app. 

0:16:48 Kathy Kempff: Exactly. So the app is called ALZ Fundraising, and so when you log in, it’ll know who you are. So based on what you are participating in, you either could get the walk experience or a ride experience or maybe an endurance experience. So you could have those sub brands within that same collective whole. 

0:17:07 Taylor Wilson: I like that. Yeah, because it does it like it brings that brand consistency. This is a really good example of like where brand consistency kind of comes into place that a lot of times it’s easy to sort of like go on these one off directions, but when you think about like the full life cycle experience of someone with an organization or with your brand, like that consistency across touch points matters so much. 

0:17:34 Taylor Wilson: All right, let’s get into data versus instinct. When you are building products, I’ve gone on a lot of instinct for building kind of what we’re about to launch, but like a lot of like anecdotal data over the years and like customer interview and like market interview type data. Tell me about how you think and how you balance data versus instinct when you’re approaching product creation. 

0:18:00 Kathy Kempff: In lieu of data, I use instinct, but if I have data, I would always use data. So when you’re creating your mvp, you can get customer feedback and things to that effect. But quite frankly, you’re getting guided by your instinct, your experience, what you think should work, or what clients want and need. Then once you launch, use data to help refine. That would be my recommendation, and I can give you a really good example of that. 

0:18:30 Kathy Kempff: When we first launched our product post pandemic, in my mind, everyone’s using QR codes. QR codes is the way of the future. And I wanted that to be front and center in terms of the fundraising channel. And that was my instinct. And we launched it and I was looking at my data and the conversion rate was really low. I was like, this just doesn’t make sense. Everyone’s doing QR codes. Why is this feature not working? 

0:18:59 Kathy Kempff: I could see through Google Analytics and event tracking all these users that were using the feature, but it didn’t translate into gifts. When I compared it, that conversion rate to other features, it was really not performing as well as it should. I actually started having conversations with customers, and one customer was like, well, Kathy, the reason that conversion rate isn’t really successful is most people are on their phones and if you’re sharing a QR code, they can’t scan it on their own phone. 

0:19:26 Kathy Kempff: And I was like, oh my God, like, I didn’t even realize that. Right. And so I had to put myself in the shoes of the user, not just using my instinct to help refine it. And I actually used Venmo as a, you know, example. They do a great job with sharing of their QR code. And it’s like you can do native sharing. If you’re sharing it on a mobile device, you’re sharing a URL, not an image. Because if you’re on a mobile device, you can’t scan it yourself. Right. And so it’s using the data to help refine. And now that one feature is responsible for 38% of our product revenue. 

0:20:01 Kathy Kempff: And so we went from a failing feature, even though I knew in my heart and my instinct it was a good feature, to refining it to make sure it was actually effective. And so sometimes you can be guided by instinct, but you can use data to help refine and make sure that you’re getting the results that you expect. 

0:20:20 Taylor Wilson: That is such a good story. And the fact that you turned it around and now it’s such a large driver revenue. I know, it’s funny. I’ve had some people recently do, like, semi QR codes and had that exact experience where I’m like, what do I do with this? I’m looking at it on my phone. I literally need another phone. I’ll like my kids next to me. I’ll be like, hey, give me your phone. Why? I need to scan this QR code. I can’t scan myself here. 

0:20:46 Kathy Kempff: Yeah. 

0:20:47 Taylor Wilson: It’s such a good example of, like, getting something out there, like, listening to, like, why is this not working? Like, noticing the patterns. Yeah. So, like, being open to, like, looking for patterns, seeing patterns, and then digging deeper. And then it sounds like you went to customers to get that qualitative data too, where they’re like, oh, yeah, okay, got it. 

0:21:10 Kathy Kempff: Well, and I think the other thing is, as a, you know, a founder, product designer is being okay with someone calling your baby ugly. Right. It’s like you put a lot of blood, sweat, and tears into developing your product. You think it’s great, but you have to be open to that feedback and open to someone criticizing it and helping you make it better. And so, you know, just being able to have those great conversations with customers and letting them tear it apart so that you can figure out and identify and pull out those nuggets that you think are really valuable that can help make the product better. 

0:21:44 Taylor Wilson: So on that topic, okay, here’s one thing I notice and I see and I get this feedback. First off. Yes. Like, your baby’s ugly. Okay, tell me why. Because I thought I Had a cute bonnet on today. But there’s also on the flip side of that, once you start building product, everyone will always have an opinion. There’s always going to be like, oh, y’all should do this. Oh, y’all should do this. Oh, y’all should do this. 

0:22:09 Taylor Wilson: And so there’s a lot of one off opinions that I find that aren’t necessarily. Some of them are great and they are like the greater good of thinking. But sometimes there’s just a lot of one off opinions too. In terms of like feature requests, how do you manage that? 

0:22:27 Kathy Kempff: So that’s a great point. I will say. The first year our product roadmap was really driven by our two largest customers. But to your point, I think it was really getting driven by just those enterprise voices versus our entire customer base. So what we did last year is we actually launched our product council and we set up two 90 minute calls with them. All the customers had one seat at the table. Everyone is equal whether you’re small or large. 

0:22:55 Kathy Kempff: And we presented a number of different product feature ideas that they had given to us and we had generated ourselves and gave them a platform to add more. And then we gave each of those products a points value. So T shirt sizing like small, medium, large. And we gave each of them a number of points to spend. So if you had 100 points for the year, where would you allocate your spend? And so we looked at what are the features that had the most points points and most votes and making sure that we weren’t just letting one or two customers drive the roadmap and the squeaky wheel. 

0:23:36 Kathy Kempff: But is it really representing of like how everyone would prioritize these features to make sure that we were listening and helping them guide our roadmap rather than us without their input or just a couple of clients. 

0:23:50 Taylor Wilson: Okay, I like that. Yeah, that’s a good way to like get people involved and kind of like make it a little bit fun with the point system too. Yeah, I like that you did that as opposed to just like, hey, what are your, what do you think you like? Like you kind of put like a system to around it. I like that a lot. That’s really, really good. Okay, so to sort of close this out today, I am curious. Give me like a funny moment you’ve had as someone who is a startup founder building a technology company. 

0:24:20 Taylor Wilson: I think just kind of starting from scratch yourself and like building a team and building a client base. Like give me one of those moments. That was like a really, really like, wow, that was awesome. And then a moment where you’re like, shit, I like wish I had known to do that differently. 

0:24:37 Kathy Kempff: I would say a good moment was really the importance of connecting with the partnership. When I first started, I deprioritized that because I thought it was more important to be close with the customers themselves. And when I started building relationships with those partners and starting seeing fruits of that, those relationships and starting to get referral business and a word of mouth, because the word of mouth, especially in this sector is so important and vital to get recommendations. 

0:25:15 Kathy Kempff: I think that was probably a pivotal moment for us in terms of growth is making sure the word on the street was they’re great customers are so happy and you’re going to be able to raise more money. A not great moment, I would say is building features or products that I didn’t necessarily have a customer for. So, you know, there were integrations that we built that it’s like, oh, if we build this integration, customers will come. 

0:25:45 Kathy Kempff: And what I really learned is like, don’t do it unless you have a customer. And because if you don’t have a customer, who knows if you actually have that demand. And so I would say that’s probably the biggest thing I learned is don’t do it unless there’s already someone at your door saying I want it. Whether it’s a feature or a new integration. Because that’s really indicative of is there actually a market for it? Is there demand? 

0:26:14 Kathy Kempff: And so I think there’s a couple of things that you know, we built over the last couple of years that if I had hindsight 20 20, I probably would have waited until there was demand before making that investment. Because like to your point, you know, I bootstrapped the whole thing. I had to carefully figure out where am I investing, where am I getting the biggest bang for my buck. And I don’t think that that was the best investment in the early days. 

0:26:39 Taylor Wilson: Do you have just to add on that this kind of final point to make any like one big tip you’d give to someone who’s bootstrapping technology company. 

0:26:50 Kathy Kempff: Take it one day at a time, but have a long term vision. I actually went back and I was working with an executive coach and had a one year and a three year plan I had laid out. And I kept revisiting it to make sure that I was not taking shortcuts, I wasn’t taking revenue to take revenue. I was like, this is the type of revenue that I want and the type of business that I want to run and operate and not Grow to grow, right? It’s making sure you are staying true to who you want to be down the road. 

0:27:22 Kathy Kempff: Not just like, oh, that’s attractive revenue, but you might regret where you end up landing. So if you almost think about the analogy of like, you’re floating on a rail and you’re on a raft, it’s like, are you actually rowing and going somewhere? Are you letting the flow and the current take you and then you don’t know where you land? So I think it’s making sure that you’re rowing, you are actually in charge of where you’re going and you’re making those cognitive decisions along the way and being very intentional and deliberate rather than just letting life take you. 

0:27:54 Taylor Wilson: I love it. The dogs had something to say about that, too. 

0:27:57 Kathy Kempff: Well, the yard people just arrived, so perfect time. 

0:28:00 Taylor Wilson: I was like, someone’s at the door, someone’s at the door. Well, hey, Kathy. Kathy Kemp, it’s been awesome to talk to you. Thanks for, thanks for being my friend and for, you know, just kind of being a good partner in our sector. Another Kathy and I like to talk a lot because we’re both like bootstrapping companies that started sort of right around the same time. And so it’s been fun to, like, talk to each other through the journey. 

0:28:28 Taylor Wilson: And I just always appreciate you so much. 

0:28:30 Kathy Kempff: I do, too. It’s always nice to lead on someone who’s going through similar challenges and opportunities and have someone that you can count on for advice. So I appreciate you and I’m so excited to see how your new product launch comes as well. 

0:28:47 Taylor Wilson: Yeah. Coming soon. Coming soon. All right, so if people want to find you online, get in touch, learn more about Nuclavis. What’s the best way to do that? 

0:28:54 Kathy Kempff: Nuclavis.com and you can always reach out to us@infouclevis.com Cool. 

0:28:58 Taylor Wilson: We’ll put that in the show notes too. Until next time, friends. I hope this was helpful. I hope it inspired you in some way. And go get that good Shizzle done. Well, hey there. That was fun. I love how much mind blowing and mind opening Shizzle our guests bring to us with every single episode. We hope you enjoyed the conversation as much as we did. Make sure to hit that subscribe button on your favorite podcast player so that you don’t miss a beat of the Talking Shizzle podcast. 

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